New IB15's ready to ship

[stryke]

We now have the first batch of IB15's packaged up and ready to go out the door. They are intended for home theater infinite baffle use, and as a result are 8ohm drivers. Running a pair in parallel at 4ohm off a modest pro audio amplifier will easily push these drivers to high levels. They have a full copper sleeve on the pole to lower inductance and distortion. Due to the low inductance they also have very good high frequency extension which could be beneficial in dipole applications. They are hand coated paper cone with a hand coated and sealed foam surround. Here are the parameters:

Fs: 16Hz
Qms: 6.8
Vas: 439L
Cms: .45mm/N
Mms: 220g
Rms: 3.239
Xmax: 18.5mm
Xmech: 25mm
Sd: 830sqcm
Vd: 3.07L (p-p)
Qes: .78
Re: 5.5ohm
Le: .33mH
Bl:12.49
Pe: 500W
Qts: .7
1WSPL: 86dB
2.83V: 87.3dB

IB15 Dimensional Drawing
http://www.aespeakers.com/pdfs/IB15-dimensional.pdf
Weight: 19lbs

COMING SOON - $199 each or 4 for $700

The goal was for a driver that would give a low F3 point, requiring no eq to boost the low end. The other goal was for a very low distortion, low inductance driver. As you can see from the parameters, Le is a tiny .33mH, lower than many midbass/midrange drivers.

Modeled in an IB alignment gives a Qtc of over .7 with F3 of around 17hz. Four of these drivers with a total of 600W will reach Xmax at 20hz, while delivering a level of just under 120dB without any room gain figured in. You can expect very good output levels as low as 10hz in room.

Here is a quick picture of the initial batch of drivers on the tables being built, followed by a couple pics taken of the finished woofers.







John

[ballasnt]

Wow, those look very nice. I have a friend looking for a pair of 15s to run infinite baffle but really needs dual 4 ohm due to his amps putting out about 300rms a channel at 4 ohms.

Very interesting parameters though!

[stryke]

Wow, those look very nice. I have a friend looking for a pair of 15s to run infinite baffle but really needs dual 4 ohm due to his amps putting out about 300rms a channel at 4 ohms.

Very interesting parameters though!

Is this for a car IB use or home theater? For home theater I'd suggest 4 of them as a minimum to really get good output levels. Adding 2 more woofers to a plenum isn't usually too difficult. And then the 300W x 2 at 4ohm would be nearly perfect for them.

John

[ballasnt]

It would be home theater and I asked him about his amps just yesterday. He said 100 at 8 ohms and 200 at 4 ohms. He has two of them and they're two channels each.

I'm not too sure if he's interested as we didn't talk much but I know I would love to try one IB if I had the room!

[stryke]

It would be home theater and I asked him about his amps just yesterday. He said 100 at 8 ohms and 200 at 4 ohms. He has two of them and they're two channels each.

I'm not too sure if he's interested as we didn't talk much but I know I would love to try one IB if I had the room!

Well, keep in mind you don't need a lot of power. One of those amps with a pair of woofers on each channel at 4ohm per channel would do quite well. The difference between 100W per woofer and 150W per woofer is around 1.5dB in total headroom which is very minimal.

John

[Aaron Smith]

John, How do you think two of these per L/C/R would do as dipole midbass from 60-300 Hz?

Quick rundown of the system:

I've always like the coherence of a concentric speaker for home theater use. The original plan was to use my Tannoy 10" dual-concentrics for L/C/R, but I stumbled onto some writing from TAD's director of engineering Andrew Jones (used to be Kef's chief development engineer) talking about his preference of not taking the mid in a concentric speaker down below about 300 Hz. This makes a lot of sense to me. Also, the 10's I have are noticeably more 'beamy' than my 6.5" dc's; the 6.5's seem to dissappear better. Each 6.5" dc would get about 150 watts from an Emotiva LPA-1.

This led me to the idea of using a dedicated midbass. I originally was looking into a single sealed 12" or 15", but saw you were back in action and had the IB15's coming up. The Le on these things is crazy-low; pretty similar to the Lambda stuff, huh?

For sub-bass, I have 2 of your original AV15's and 6 of the TC variants that were closed out...I'm well aware of the potential issues now but already have them, so we will see what happens...these will be IB.

I have some QSC DCA1622's available, which can output about 500 watts into each pair of IB15's at 4 ohms. I'm only planning on using one for the 8 15's in the IB (w/ a QSC DSP-4).

What do you think -- would two dipole pair per L/C/R work out with the rest of the system? Anything you would do different?

Thanks,

Aaron

[CupCak3]

John, How do you think two of these per L/C/R would do as dipole midbass from 60-300 Hz?

Quick rundown of the system:

I've always like the coherence of a concentric speaker for home theater use. The original plan was to use my Tannoy 10" dual-concentrics for L/C/R, but I stumbled onto some writing from TAD's director of engineering Andrew Jones (used to be Kef's chief development engineer) talking about his preference of not taking the mid in a concentric speaker down below about 300 Hz. This makes a lot of sense to me. Also, the 10's I have are noticeably more 'beamy' than my 6.5" dc's; the 6.5's seem to dissappear better. Each 6.5" dc would get about 150 watts from an Emotiva LPA-1.

This led me to the idea of using a dedicated midbass. I originally was looking into a single sealed 12" or 15", but saw you were back in action and had the IB15's coming up. The Le on these things is crazy-low; pretty similar to the Lambda stuff, huh?

For sub-bass, I have 2 of your original AV15's and 6 of the TC variants that were closed out...I'm well aware of the potential issues now but already have them, so we will see what happens...these will be IB.

I have some QSC DCA1622's available, which can output about 500 watts into each pair of IB15's at 4 ohms. I'm only planning on using one for the 8 15's in the IB (w/ a QSC DSP-4).

What do you think -- would two dipole pair per L/C/R work out with the rest of the system? Anything you would do different?

Thanks,

Aaron

John: Could you provide us w/ some distortion plots of the IB15?

It does seem like these speaker would have pretty low distortion and make great midbass drivers. Actually, with a bit EQing putting these in a small sealed box doesn't seem too terrible. Can anyone comment how this would effect the sound and accuracy of the driver?


John: BTW, what the heck are your store hours? I don't think I've ever had anyone pickup the phone when I call.

[stryke]

John, How do you think two of these per L/C/R would do as dipole midbass from 60-300 Hz?

Quick rundown of the system:

I've always like the coherence of a concentric speaker for home theater use. The original plan was to use my Tannoy 10" dual-concentrics for L/C/R, but I stumbled onto some writing from TAD's director of engineering Andrew Jones (used to be Kef's chief development engineer) talking about his preference of not taking the mid in a concentric speaker down below about 300 Hz. This makes a lot of sense to me. Also, the 10's I have are noticeably more 'beamy' than my 6.5" dc's; the 6.5's seem to dissappear better. Each 6.5" dc would get about 150 watts from an Emotiva LPA-1.

This led me to the idea of using a dedicated midbass. I originally was looking into a single sealed 12" or 15", but saw you were back in action and had the IB15's coming up. The Le on these things is crazy-low; pretty similar to the Lambda stuff, huh?

For sub-bass, I have 2 of your original AV15's and 6 of the TC variants that were closed out...I'm well aware of the potential issues now but already have them, so we will see what happens...these will be IB.

I have some QSC DCA1622's available, which can output about 500 watts into each pair of IB15's at 4 ohms. I'm only planning on using one for the 8 15's in the IB (w/ a QSC DSP-4).

What do you think -- would two dipole pair per L/C/R work out with the rest of the system? Anything you would do different?

Thanks,

Aaron

Hi Aaron,

I think they could work well based on the Q and the low inductance, although I haven't tried them in a dipole application. You may want to have a little more efficiency, and you really don't need as much mass if you are going to cover 60-300hz. Lambda had a Dipole 15 specifically for this kind of use. I have parts for something like 23 of them sitting at the shop yet. Here is the original info:

The Lambda Dipole15 Driver is designed specifically for open baffle use with added EQ. This is a high xmax, stiff paper cone, coated and sealed foam surround, 12 spoke aluminum basket, 60oz magnet, dual gold binding posts, and military spec coatings and glues. This a massive *underhung* driver with clean high excursion response to 2Khz. Due to the underhung motor design the power handling is much lower than our other drivers, however these drivers were designed to be used in multiples per channel of 2~8 drivers, hence the power handling is right where it is needed. This driver has some of the best midrange performance of any Lambda product, and there is some interest in using it as a powerful bassmid in a large sealed cabinet, call for more details. Available in dual 8ohm coils only, specs are with both voice coils wired in series.

Fs: 21.7hz
Qms: 15.2
Qes: 1.00
Qts: .94
Vas: 623L
Cms: .7mm/N
Mms: 90grams
Sd: 855sqcm
Rms: .81Kg/S
Bl: 12.2Tm
Re: 12.3ohm
Z: 16ohm
Le: .15mH
Xmax: 12mm
1w SPL: 90.1dB


This would probably be the overall ultimate way to go with a pair of these per channel. The low mass, very low inductance, ruller flat BL curve of the underhung design, and higher sensitivity would be great to cover that range.

John

[Aaron Smith]

The Lambda Dipole15 Driver is designed specifically for open baffle use with added EQ. This is a high xmax, stiff paper cone, coated and sealed foam surround, 12 spoke aluminum basket, 60oz magnet, dual gold binding posts, and military spec coatings and glues. This a massive *underhung* driver with clean high excursion response to 2Khz. Due to the underhung motor design the power handling is much lower than our other drivers, however these drivers were designed to be used in multiples per channel of 2~8 drivers, hence the power handling is right where it is needed. This driver has some of the best midrange performance of any Lambda product, and there is some interest in using it as a powerful bassmid in a large sealed cabinet, call for more details. Available in dual 8ohm coils only, specs are with both voice coils wired in series.

Fs: 21.7hz
Qms: 15.2
Qes: 1.00
Qts: .94
Vas: 623L
Cms: .7mm/N
Mms: 90grams
Sd: 855sqcm
Rms: .81Kg/S
Bl: 12.2Tm
Re: 12.3ohm
Z: 16ohm
Le: .15mH
Xmax: 12mm
1w SPL: 90.1dB


This would probably be the overall ultimate way to go with a pair of these per channel. The low mass, very low inductance, ruller flat BL curve of the underhung design, and higher sensitivity would be great to cover that range.

John

John, These sound sweet! Running these, I could go ahead and sell 2 of my DCA-1622's and pick up another Emotiva LPA-1 6-channel and run 200 watts 4 ohms into each driver...would 200 watts per do the trick for the Dipole15's? Seems like mating a DCX2496 would be ideal in this setup.

How much would a batch of 6 of these run?

Aaron

[stryke]

John: Could you provide us w/ some distortion plots of the IB15?

It does seem like these speaker would have pretty low distortion and make great midbass drivers. Actually, with a bit EQing putting these in a small sealed box doesn't seem too terrible. Can anyone comment how this would effect the sound and accuracy of the driver?


John: BTW, what the heck are your store hours? I don't think I've ever had anyone pickup the phone when I call.

I could do some distortion plots with Praxis, although it's hard to compare to anything as the test conditions greatly affect the results. It would be nice to do some comparisons to other drivers all at the same time. I hope in the near future to be getting a Klippel and then I can do some really serious measurements.

As far as the midbass goes, I'd like a stronger motor and more efficiency than the IB15's really have. The TD15M was really intended as a midbass type driver and comes in 10", 12" and 15" size. It has the original lambda type motor with the phase plug. These are quite flat up to 4KHz on axis and to 2KHz at about 30degrees off axis.

As far as the sealed box goes, the problem with the IB15's is with the high Q and high Vas, you will get a very high Qtc in a smaller sealed box. We have several woofers that work better in smaller sealed boxes.

The hours of operation are 9am-5:30pm, however we don't have anyone in the office most of the time. I have one machinist, one QC/shipping person, one person to build woofers, and one person who works in the woodshop and spray booth. Then myself of course. I also have a lady who comes in to do most of the office work but she only works a few hours a day. We're still so busy setting up things in the woodshop, setting up more production equipment, and trying to get OEM orders filled that nobody is usually there to answer the phone. In the next few weeks as we have our own product line starting to ship out I'll be getting someone fulltime to answer the phone and take orders. Right now we just don't have a lot to sell for a few weeks though so it isn't practical yet. I do try to get through all the messages every few days though.

John

[DevilDriver]

Looking stellar John. That modified 12 spoke is actually surprisingly open. Be sure to post when you have some of these available as I wouldn't mind a couple IB15's.

edit: I will be emailing you again shortly. Look forward to further discussion on some topics.

[CupCak3]

John: Could you provide us w/ some distortion plots of the IB15?

It does seem like these speaker would have pretty low distortion and make great midbass drivers. Actually, with a bit EQing putting these in a small sealed box doesn't seem too terrible. Can anyone comment how this would effect the sound and accuracy of the driver?


John: BTW, what the heck are your store hours? I don't think I've ever had anyone pickup the phone when I call.

I could do some distortion plots with Praxis, although it's hard to compare to anything as the test conditions greatly affect the results. It would be nice to do some comparisons to other drivers all at the same time. I hope in the near future to be getting a Klippel and then I can do some really serious measurements.

As far as the midbass goes, I'd like a stronger motor and more efficiency than the IB15's really have. The TD15M was really intended as a midbass type driver and comes in 10", 12" and 15" size. It has the original lambda type motor with the phase plug. These are quite flat up to 4KHz on axis and to 2KHz at about 30degrees off axis.

As far as the sealed box goes, the problem with the IB15's is with the high Q and high Vas, you will get a very high Qtc in a smaller sealed box. We have several woofers that work better in smaller sealed boxes.

The hours of operation are 9am-5:30pm, however we don't have anyone in the office most of the time. I have one machinist, one QC/shipping person, one person to build woofers, and one person who works in the woodshop and spray booth. Then myself of course. I also have a lady who comes in to do most of the office work but she only works a few hours a day. We're still so busy setting up things in the woodshop, setting up more production equipment, and trying to get OEM orders filled that nobody is usually there to answer the phone. In the next few weeks as we have our own product line starting to ship out I'll be getting someone fulltime to answer the phone and take orders. Right now we just don't have a lot to sell for a few weeks though so it isn't practical yet. I do try to get through all the messages every few days though.

John

YGPM

[stryke]

I wanted to get up some response graphs as many people were asking for them. The main goal of the IB15's is to cover the bottom octave without any need for EQ to boost the low end response. While the overall efficiency of the driver isn't extremely high, they will require very little power to move effectively on the bottom end.



This first graph shows the output levels with a group of 4 IB15's with 150W per driver. Notice right around 119.5dB at 20hz, without a lot of power required.


This graph is just showing the normalized response. The F3 point is right at 16.8hz and the Qtc would be equal to the Qts of the driver, .7. Theoretically a Qtc of .707 will give the lowest F3 point.


The final graph is showing the displacement of the IB15's with the 600W input power. At 20hz you are just surpassing the 18.5mm Xmax with the 600W input power. Above 20hz you can put in a good deal more input power and get much higher output levels.

John

[stryke]

Apparently I forgot somewhere to mention the price for these. Guess I'm not much of a salesman when i don't even give people a price. Oops. They are $129 each, or four for $400. There is another small price break at 10pcs.

John

[PHilPOT]

We now have the first batch of IB15's packaged up and ready to go out the door. They are intended for home theater infinite baffle use, and as a result are 8ohm drivers. Running a pair in parallel at 4ohm off a modest pro audio amplifier will easily push these drivers to high levels. They have a full copper sleeve on the pole to lower inductance and distortion. Due to the low inductance they also have very good high frequency extension which could be beneficial in dipole applications. They are hand coated paper cone with a hand coated and sealed foam surround. Here are the parameters:

Fs: 16Hz
Qms: 6.8
Vas: 439L
Cms: .45mm/N
Mms: 220g
Rms: 3.239
Xmax: 18.5mm
Xmech: 25mm
Sd: 830sqcm
Vd: 3.07L (p-p)
Qes: .78
Re: 5.5ohm
Le: .33mH
Bl:12.49
Pe: 500W
Qts: .7
1WSPL: 86dB
2.83V: 87.3dB

The goal was for a driver that would give a low F3 point, requiring no eq to boost the low end. The other goal was for a very low distortion, low inductance driver. As you can see from the parameters, Le is a tiny .33mH, lower than many midbass/midrange drivers.

Modeled in an IB alignment gives a Qtc of over .7 with F3 of around 17hz. Four of these drivers with a total of 600W will reach Xmax at 20hz, while delivering a level of just under 120dB without any room gain figured in. You can expect very good output levels as low as 10hz in room.

Here is a quick picture of the initial batch of drivers on the tables being built, followed by a couple pics taken of the finished woofers.







John

That's one sharp looking driver. I love the way the colors from the backplate and magnet complement the silver/black basket... SEXY, LMAO.